Joined on 07-05-2006
TechSoup Member
We got a nice IBM T41 from/through TechSoup and it's been fine. WE use it really as a backup and it's rarely one - maybe once a week. No bumps, bangs, etc. since we got it.
A couple of days ago, a "lovely"bright horizontal white line appeared across the middle of the LCD screen. It's not supposed to be there - and the 90 days coverage is up. So my question is whether anyone else has seen such things and what's to be done? Or have I now got a trashed refurb. unit that I have to live with?
Please advise gently . . .
G. Beker
Joined on 06-09-2003
Davenport, Iowa USA
If you plug an external monitor into the laptop, is the horizontal line in the external display too?
If it is just in the LCD screen, you have a display problem and will have to check on repair costs, to living with the problem. In this case if the laptop is used at a desk location, using an external display and keyboard / mouse is an effective way to continue to use the resource.
If you can find a friendly service center that does laptop repair they may be able to replace the display with a used display for a reasonable cost.
If it is in both, it still could be a hardware problem, or it could be a driver problem. trying a restore point, or reinstalling display drivers may help.
Unfortunately with non renewable maintenance agreements and warranties trouble usually happens after the coverage is over.
Dave
Joined on 07-20-2005
Hartford, CT
Well, if its the LCD Screen (that's my best guess without tinkering with it myself), then you're on the hook for repairing it or living with it. That's the problem with refurbs, unfortunately. The limited warranty. 90 days is actually a very progressive warranty on a refurb unit; they are typically 30 days or less! I'm sorry this happened to you.
First, I found out where you can
buy replacement screens. However, you're probably better off buying another refurb unit and switching the hard drives between them due to the price of the screens (what I saw started them at $320). Then you have an entire laptop to use as spare parts - or hooked up to an external monitor. It could actually be turned into some sort of server should you so desire.
Joined on 07-05-2006
TechSoup Member
Thanks to the both of you for your comments and insights.
What I am waithing for now is just to see what the folks at TechSoup say - after all they vouched for this puppy - and they sold it to me making the statement that it was good stuff. Having run a major PR/media firm (all Fortune 50 clients) in NY/CT for 25 years or so, I know there's a difference between a "class act" and "just doin' my job." I will report.
G. Beker
Joined on 07-20-2005
Hartford, CT
Well, I honestly wouldn't hold your breath. If they replace the unit, that would be far above and beyond a very good policy. They told you it was good stuff, and to back it up they said they'd warranty it for 90 days. I wouldn't expect them to replace anything after the warranty expired, and I'm not sure why you would expect it.
It's probably the inverter bar. Try setting the display to power off after 5 or 10 minutes. The computer will stay on while the display powers off. I've found this trick to extend the life of problem LCD's at times.
As Dave suggests, try an external monitor on the T41. That will distinguish whether it's a problem with the LCD or something else like the onboard video card.
It's tough dealing with refurbs at times, for both vendors and customers. Vendors are not mfg'ers. They can only test and verify that a piece of hardware works at a given point in time. As Chris points out, 30 days is the norm for guaranteeing refurbs. 90 days is indeed generous. Beyond that, there's so many variables that can occur, it's not fair to expect more.
Last week I was out at a friends house looking over her network and the old laptop she'd given her son last year is now overheating. He quite naively left it run all the time and would simply close the lid. What happened over time is the laptop got cooked because it wasn't designed for that. Laptops should be powered off when not in use as they were not meant to be on all the time like desktops and servers.
HTH, Karl
Joined on 05-11-2005
TechSoup Member
Hi George,
First of all, thank you for your post and feedback.
We’re glad to hear that you were satisfied with the products you received through the RCI program, and agree that it’s unfortunate that the problems you’re having with your laptop LCD occurred outside of our 90-day warranty period. As the RCI program return policy clearly indicates, however, product issues that arise outside of this timeframe are not covered.
At this point, we recommend that you try the various testing and troubleshooting steps suggested by the other helpful community members who’ve replied to this thread, and hope that you’ll be able to remedy the problem with your computer equipment.
Best Wishes,
RCI Admin
TechSoup
Joined on 07-05-2006
TechSoup Member
As A guy who ran a PR/media firm (all Fortune 50 clients) before giving my time to the non-profit world, this is exactly what I hate. First, RCI says they are "glad to hear that you were satisfied with the products you received through the RCI program" I never said I was "satisfied" with what turned out - in a rather short period of time - to be a dog of a purchase. This is the classic "big lie" approach. All I said was the laptop was fine but that it failed rather quickly. If that's "satisfied," these folks have a different dictionary that I have.
That said, I did try out the much-appreciated suggestions above (thanks to all) - but the problem IS the laptop. Period. The outputto an external monitor doesn't show the line, restoring back to before the problem survfaced does noting. Like I said, the laptop failed.
So, after hiding out for for more thana week, RCI comes forward with some glad-handing.
Based on my experience (which, by the way, included the fact that the laptop has a useless battery), I'dl say that spending your dollars on RCI's stuff may well be a very questionable expense.
I will report more as (and if) RCI replies now that they know that the problem IS the laptop.
Best to all!
G. Beker
Joined on 02-18-2004
New Hampshire
Hi G. Beker, I understand your frustrations with purchasing a refurb and having it break. You have been given a few troubleshooting steps, which proved that it wasn't your video card or motherboard. The problem lies in the LCD or the inverter. You may be able to fix the problem rather cheaply if you can find another unit that has a bad motherboard on ebay. I've done that with an old hp that I had.
Joined on 05-11-2005
TechSoup Member
Hi George,
I'm sorry if it appeared that we at TechSoup were making presumptions about your experience and satisfaction with your computer. The intent was to start our conversation on a positive note, rather than minimize your experience, and I apologize for the miscommunication in our previous post.
Unfortunately, as your computer is outside of our 90-day warranty period, I'm afraid that there is nothing more we can do to assist you in replacing the laptop LCD. That said, if you do decide to look into getting the machine serviced, we have a tool that may prove useful in helping you find additional technical support resources in your area called TechFinder. You can access the search tool by going to http://www.techsoup.org/techfinder/techsoup/index.cfm.
Best Wishes,
RCI Admin
TechSoup
Joined on 07-05-2006
TechSoup Member
Well, here's my take. In theory, the refurbished equipment deal at TechSoup seems great - and (sadly) we were gulled by what appeared to be a worthwhile way to conserve money. The truth has turned out to be a fantasy. Between the lousy battery, the failed screen, and the time wasted, we'd have been better off to buy a new machine.
To tell us that we could use the machine as a back-up desktop is technically right - but irrelevant; we bought a laptop beccause we needed a LAPTOP.
And RCI's apologia sure works for them - it does nothing for us. I had assumed too much - that RCI would make a class-act stretch (they didn't) and that the hardware had a lot of predictably good life in it (it didn't).
This as been a moderately expensive (and useless) "learning experience."
Based on what happened to us, the whole techSoup/RCI "deal" should be very carefully considered (and probably avoided) - at least as far as laptops go. Sorry . . .
Joined on 07-20-2005
Hartford, CT
Well, I wouldn't use the term
"gulled" as it implies that the TechSoup's RCI program is deliberately attempting to deceive its clients for profit. That is simply not the case.
That being said, I can definitely see George's frustration. The description of the
RCI Program doesn't describe the refurbished purchasing process well at all. It should clearly indicate the reason why someone might want to buy a refurbished computer. It should also define the potential risk involved.
Sorry George, better luck next time.
Joined on 06-09-2003
Davenport, Iowa USA
My two year old HP laptop now overheats locks up and corrupts the hard drive. The manufacturer warranty is one year. I have no expectation of HP making any resolution of a product outside of its warranty.
The HP replaced an IBM think pad that crashed its hard drive a few months out of warranty. I was extremely grateful that IBM sold me the recovery media on an out of warranty machine because I didn't burn the disks.
A refurbished Dell laptop purchased in 2002 has had two battery replacements, the first because the battery failed a few weeks after purchase and the battery is specifically excluded from the Dell refurbished warranty. It is a cost of business, and a factor of risk.
If some one extends a warranty for you that is a nice thing to have happen, but warranties have time limits, used cars are sold with out warranties, I do not have any warranty expectation on my 10 year old van, it becomes an operating expense to perform repairs and maintenance on anything that happens to it that is not covered by warranty or maintenance agreement.
Understand how warranties are paid for. In the design cycle you look at the projected failure rate over the number of units to be made, determine factors of the length of warranty versus the life of the product and the bell curve of the failure rates. You then determine the average cost of repair for the warranty period offered times the number of units expected to fail, divide that by the number of units you are going to sell and increase the price by that amount and some profit. So the end customer pays for the warranty anyway.
In some instances the customer absorbs the risk and plays the odds of a failure happening to them and buy the shorter warranty, (or buys a unit with a specific limited warranty), understanding they absorb the risk of any repair and maintenance on day 31, 91 or day 366. If you can't absorb the risk, you need to pay for the extended coverage, or buy a unit that the extended coverage is available.
Dave
Joined on 07-05-2006
TechSoup Member
You're of course right that contractually (as drafted by hoardes of white-lipped attorneys holed up in fancy offices) that I received a warranty for 90 days and the laptop failed beyond that. True. What would be interesting to know is how many of RCI's laptops actually fail within and beyond the warranty period. It a goodly number fail just beyond the 90 days (but not too far beyond), then RCI's 90 days is good for them. If, on the other hand, their machines have a pretty low failure rate then RCI has an opportunity to extend themselves and somehow deal with the problem for the few who got lemon machines - in the process becoming a "class act."
Over the years, I have dealt with a lot of companies (and as the president of a pr/media firm for Fortune 50 clients I had the chance to see numerous corporate policies in action). Some companies truly are "class acts" that make the stretch. And in my experience, those arte the firms that in the end benefit. There's an old saying (that I'll clean up a bit) in the marketing biz that says, "It takes ten 'atta boys' to make up for one 'Aw, crap!'" The point being that RCI will probably lose at least a few sales from this small TechSoup discussionand other word of mouth failures. Had they acted promptly and tried to help us out, we'd be saying nice things. In honesty, all I can say now is it was a bad deal fro us and others need to be aware of the pitfalls. And I suggest that,from a marketing point of view, RCI has lost something too . . .
Best with your next laptop purchase!
Joined on 08-20-2001
San Francisco, CA and the web
There's been a number of opinions and advice given, but I think we've exhausted the usefulness of this topic, so I'm closing up the discussion.